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The Great Google Ads Debate | Amalia Fowler & Jyll Saskin Gales

22 ideas de marketing sacadas de «The Great Google Ads Debate | Amalia Fowler & Jyll Saskin Gales», de Jyll Saskin Gales | Google Ads Coach. Sobre todo de…

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Apaga las recomendaciones automaticas: al sistema le falta el contexto del negocio

Medición y experimentos

Las dos coinciden en desactivarlas, y al auditar una cuenta que las tiene encendidas lo primero es apagarlas. El argumento de fondo es que la plataforma no deberia cambiar cosas en la cuenta de alguien sin que pase por una persona, y que eso ademas pone en riesgo la relacion con el cliente. El ejemplo concreto del dano: anadir un grupo de anuncios dinamico a una campana de marca, cuando el proposito de esa campana…

oh i just don't think google has a right to change things in people's accounts automatically without it being filtered through a person um i don't think my opinion will ever change on that they could have the best machine learning in the world they could understand semantics i could be matching to terms that make sense and i still would say do not write ads for me just it's the same i wouldn't let like if someone walked by in front of my house i wouldn't be like what do you think about like write an ad for me like it's it's hard and one of the things i tell my clients all the time is i don't…

Escúchalo en el minuto 38:10

Como sacarle algo al representante de la plataforma: preguntas concretas y una sola cuenta gestora

Canales de adquisición

Su consejo es tratarlo como una relacion de dos direcciones y preguntar directamente: dame ejemplos de como podemos trabajar juntos, como son tus relaciones exitosas con otros clientes, que tipo de informacion les das, que recomendaciones les aplicas, que deberia esperar de ti y que no deberia esperar. Lo peor que puede pasar es que digan que no. La otra recomienda tomar siempre la primera llamada cuando aparece un…

but i don't like the like random roll of the dice it ends up being so i try and which is what i recommend everyone does is like take that first call and then if it ends up not working out then like go from there but every time it's a new name maybe give them a chance because you don't know you could end up with again here is that um the relationship with the google rep is a two-way relationship and so if there's something you want out of the relationship something you want to know like as someone who doesn't work at google you can also ask them and so some question that i suggest that you ask…

Escúchalo en el minuto 36:14

Los valores por defecto y el lenguaje de la plataforma empujan al error

Canales de adquisición

Al crear una campana de busqueda vienen marcadas por defecto la red de display y los socios de busqueda, y cuando desmarcas display aparece el aviso de que la mayoria de los anunciantes usa esa opcion. La critica es que ese mensaje no dice que a la mayoria le vaya mejor asi, solo que la mayoria no sabe que hay que desmarcarla. La otra peticion concreta es de lenguaje: que no llamen mejora al cambio a concordancia…

to make um my favorite is when they combine search and display network in the setup box and you unclick display and it says most advertisers use this setting yeah because most of them don't know any better you're not saying most advertisers do better with this setting you're just saying most people don't know to unclick that box but the average person doesn't know how to switch to expert mode doesn't understand like make money but i do think that some of their educational pieces are very swayed towards them and don't provide enough context for the average business owner and it makes me…

Escúchalo en el minuto 19:10

Campanas automaticas de maximo rendimiento: si para comercio electronico, dudoso para captacion de contactos

Canales de adquisición

Su criterio, que describe como una relacion de amistad y enemistad a la vez: en teoria son fantasticas, en la practica fallan porque el seguimiento de conversiones o el sitio no son perfectos. Las recomienda para negocios de comercio electronico muy orientados a conversion, porque ahi la conversion es una compra, es dinero real en el banco y el retorno o el costo por adquisicion son de verdad. Duda mucho mas en…

but actually not i have like a very frenemy relationship with performance max now and it's one of those things and i think this applies to a lot of automated campaign types in theory it's amazing in practice it doesn't work as well because things like conversion tracking isn't perfect or the website isn't perfect or whatever it might be so i was really gung-ho tested it with my clients and then in my coaching practice helping people set them up and run them and analyzing ones that have been running and right now today in may 2022 i definitely recommend them for e-commerce businesses that are…

Escúchalo en el minuto 12:40

La maquina necesita destino: el coche autonomo y la conversion mal elegida

Medición y experimentos

La postura intermedia: el trabajo de la maquina es encontrar cosas, pero hay que apuntarla en la direccion correcta, y para eso existen las estrategias de puja por clics o por conversiones. Su analogia es un coche autonomo, que necesita un destino y necesita entender que si hay un nino delante se para. Sin senales nuestras corre a lo loco, y el ejemplo real que ha auditado varias veces es una cuenta cuya conversion…

yeah and you make i have one final point before we wrap up um i i think i'm in the middle ground of like wanting to help the machine learn because i agree that the machine's job is to find things but i also believe that you have to point it in the right direction that's why we have clicks versus conversion types of um bid strategies etc is like it's like a self-driving car it needs a destination and it needs to understand that when the child is front of the car you don't keep driving like you stop to let the kid cross the street right so i still think it does need signals from us to kind of…

Escúchalo en el minuto 54:16

El punto de acuerdo: con dos o tres mil dolares al mes, concordancia de frase como termino medio

Canales de adquisición

Donde si coinciden las dos: para un anunciante que gasta un par de miles de dolares al mes, cifra enorme para ese dueno de negocio pero minuscula a ojos de la plataforma, ninguna recomienda concordancia amplia. La consultora describe su cartera: algunos clientes en el rango de cuarenta a cien mil dolares al mes, pero la mayoria entre dos y tres mil, y sin volumen todo tarda mucho mas en aprender. Su preferencia es…

i'd say it's pretty evenly split actually i don't sit i don't sit in a camp i start with phrase match but even then and that's not like a hard and fast rule i do have a lot of phrase match but i'm watching the spend i'm watching the matches and there's been times where i i have to move that to exact just to get what i need for the client but again most of my clients have small budgets most of my clients are i do have some that are in the 40 to 100 000 a month range so that's not small obviously but the majority of them are in the like two to three grand a month uh range and so it it is a lot…

Escúchalo en el minuto 9:24

A algunos negocios hay que decirles que no se anuncien

Medición y experimentos

Cuenta que el dia anterior alguien reservo una sesion pagada para poner en marcha sus anuncios, y en los primeros cinco minutos ella miro las metricas de conversion del sitio y le dijo que no los pusiera, que no serian rentables; dedicaron el resto de la hora a otra cosa. Su punto general es que la publicidad de buscadores sencillamente no encaja con algunos negocios, y que a menudo lo que se cuenta como los…

uh i think and you know not working at google i can say this like google ads is actually not a great fit for some businesses and that's the hard truth as well that obviously google can't take that stance but it just happened to me yesterday someone booked a coaching call with me they wanted to get google ads live and within the first five minutes i looked at their conversion metrics in the website i said don't run ads they won't be profitable and we spent the whole time talking about something else instead and like that's not a position for google to take like if you're in google ads they're…

Escúchalo en el minuto 20:37

El periodo de aprendizaje es un lujo: con presupuesto pequeno no se puede pagar

Medición y experimentos

Sus clientes literalmente no pueden permitirse dos semanas o mas, segun volumen y umbrales, de dejar que el sistema aprenda, y eso los deja en desventaja estructural. Lo que pide es informacion clara de umbrales: si hacen falta quince conversiones para que el sistema haga su trabajo, que lo digan y ella lleva la cuenta a quince antes de encenderlo, pero hoy esa informacion es confusa y general. La contraparte aporta…

talking and oh the the learning period the learning period the learning period um and again and this comes back to the budget levels i think i think we're gonna land there again yeah is that my clients often can't afford literally like cannot afford to learn to let the machine learn we can't spend you know two weeks or longer depending on volume and budget and thresholds um and i can't afford most of my clients cannot afford literally like money-wise to let um the machine learn um i don't know that there's an answer to that other than like they're just at an inherent disadvantage until things…

Escúchalo en el minuto 41:44

A favor de probar concordancia amplia: desde 50 dolares al dia y vigilando los terminos de busqueda

Canales de adquisición

La postura favorable: probar concordancia amplia en una campana de busqueda con al menos cincuenta dolares diarios, es decir cuando no se esta en modo presupuesto limitadisimo y hay margen para aprender, porque es una buena forma de descubrir que esta buscando la gente. Al auditar, si ve concordancia amplia siempre revisa el informe de terminos de busqueda: con puja automatica orientada a conversiones muchas veces…

search terms from users so my opinion on broad match keywords is that it depends but for the most part i do like to test broad match keywords when i'm working with a budget in a search campaign of at least like fifty dollars a day that means i'm not in super limited budget mode we have some room to learn and it can be a really great way to start a campaign just to learn what's available and what's out there and what people are searching when i go audit a google ads account if i see broad match keywords i will always go check the search term report and see is it doing the right thing and when…

Escúchalo en el minuto 5:52

El modo experto esta escondido: el recorrido que hay que hacer para llegar a el

Canales de adquisición

Al abrir una cuenta nueva el sistema te mete en una campana simplificada sin que sepas que lo es ni que existe un modo avanzado, cuyo acceso esta al final de la pagina donde nadie lo ve. Y no basta con pulsar: hay que montar la campana simplificada entera, activarla, pausarla, cambiar al modo avanzado, confirmar que si quieres cambiar y ademas cambiar la vista. La peticion es simple: dos casillas al crear la cuenta…

personally don't like that when you start google ads it throws you into the smart campaign you don't even know it's a smart campaign or that expert mode exists but i can also empathize with the product managers who made that decision because probably people weren't even getting a campaign live at all if you're thrown into expert mode and it's like what the heck is this you know what am i supposed to do all i'm asking for is that when when a new person opens the account that there's one box that says smart mode inexperienced and want help say whatever here and then one box that says would you…

Escúchalo en el minuto 20:18

En contra de la concordancia amplia: casi nunca, y solo con presupuesto grande y negativas robustas

Canales de adquisición

La postura contraria: usarla casi nunca. De toda su cartera recuerda dos cuentas con concordancia amplia, y las dos tienen presupuestos enormes, llevan mucho tiempo activas y listas de palabras clave negativas muy robustas. Su objecion es lo que significa relacionado: ha visto coincidencias que ni un nino de cinco anos ni alguien que acaba de aprender el idioma pondria juntas, aunque reconoce que el sistema ha…

your advice about broad match so when it comes to broad match i'm on the i will use it almost never almost never i will i i wish i had gone through my accounts to tell you exactly how many of them have broad match before we were talking i can think of two um and both of them have massive budgets they've been around for a long time and they have very very robust negative keywords uh negative keyword lists my issue with broad match is that term related that you brought up that it's like it's related to the term i have seen some matches that like a five-year-old would not place that term with…

Escúchalo en el minuto 7:16

La formacion oficial ensena la teoria, no el y ahora que

Medición y experimentos

Su valoracion del programa formativo gratuito de la plataforma: hace un gran trabajo sentando los fundamentos, que existe una subasta, como funciona, que es la calidad, y eso importa porque mucha gente abre una cuenta y se lanza sin idea. Lo que no cubre es lo practico: vale, ya entiendo el rango del anuncio, la puja y que es una conversion, y ahora que hago con eso. Ese hueco es literalmente la razon de que exista…

i really think google misses an education opportunity and i know we'll get to learning google ads as like part of what we're talking about let's get there now let's go right into that now amazing their skill shop um certifications do not lend themselves to actually teaching a small business owner like you need conversions and here's why and here's why your point about ecom and the value scale and so i think skill shop does a great job of setting the foundation for understanding like that there is an auction and how the auction works and what quality is in these type of things and i think…

Escúchalo en el minuto 14:40

Activar una recomendacion inocua para cerrar el tema con el representante

Canales de adquisición

Como cada representante tiene que sacar el tema de las recomendaciones automaticas, ella activa deliberadamente una que no afecta a los resultados: anadir audiencias en modo observacion para informes, que no gasta mas dinero ni empeora nada. Asi la casilla queda marcada y pueden pasar a hablar de otra cosa. Lo presenta como una decision de construccion de relacion que no perjudica al cliente. Y aqui esta el…

at all and so the way that i've gotten around that because i know with every google rep i've interacted with like they have to bring that up i will do them a favor which some people say i shouldn't have to but i choose to and i'll turn on one that has no impact on the results so i turn on add audiences for reporting it adds some audiences an observation it's not going to spend more money it's not going to have a bad impact and that way i've at least checked the box so that my google rep and i can move on and talk about something else um but again that's just something i choose to do for a…

Escúchalo en el minuto 40:25

Tres razones para no correr campanas automaticas de maximo rendimiento

Canales de adquisición

La postura contraria, declarando de entrada el sesgo de no haber corrido nunca ninguna. Primera razon, la falta de transparencia de datos: es responsable ante el cliente de un dinero que a ese cliente le parece mucho, y si no puede decirle a donde va ni por que, no puede hacer su trabajo; ademas le parece raro pagar por algo y no tener acceso a esos datos. Segunda, la seguridad de marca: no poder elegir las redes ni…

against uh for a couple reasons and i will say like i feel like it's very important to be up front that i have never run one because i am so against it so i feel like the need to be like i'm very biased in in so far that i've never even tried it um but there's reasons why um and three in particular and i was like thinking about these in the car this morning while i was driving back home uh the first is the lack of data that i get data transparency i'm accountable to clients for sometimes a lot of their money or what feels like a lot of their money and if i can't tell them where it's going or…

Escúchalo en el minuto 10:46

Por que desconfiar del consejo del representante: incentivos, campanas coordinadas y falta de experiencia practica

Canales de adquisición

La queja concreta: los representantes de servicio a menudo venden mas producto sin ser transparentes sobre cuando lo hacen, y cuando ella argumenta que algo no le conviene al cliente la respuesta ha sido que lo haga igualmente; su pregunta es que le diran entonces a los negocios que no tienen a alguien que sepa defender la cuenta. Desde dentro, la respuesta no confirma ni desmiente las cuotas pero si dice que hay…

but i will say that the quality has shifted and a lot of them don't seem to present themselves accurately to what you're what you're kind of saying like are you a support person are you here to manage are you here to sell are you here to advise which i would argue could include upselling i mean we've talked about this service reps often upsell but i don't think they're transparent about how they do it or when they do it or you know and a lot of them quite honestly so there is this and i don't think you can confirm or deny i wouldn't expect you to there's this myth that they have quotas and so…

Escúchalo en el minuto 30:43

Los terminos de busqueda ocultos y si el argumento de privacidad se sostiene

Medición y experimentos

La objecion: si mi cuenta genera un contacto, no deberian poder ocultarme que termino lo produjo; quita otros elementos, pero eso no. Y anade que no se le ocurre otro servicio por el que pagues sin recibir toda la informacion de lo que paso. Desde dentro, la respuesta reconoce que no sabe si esa es la razon real, pero afirma que la privacidad se toma muy en serio, con formaciones, certificaciones y niveles de…

but i think that's what part of what makes it different difficult for the mach like for that shift to have happened for the lack of location around that shift from google and then also to lose a whole bunch of our query results like i don't think that if something is driving a conversion i shouldn't be able to see it like take away some other elements but i don't believe that if my account is generating a lead that you should be able to hide what term did that for me um and i know aggregate data and all those things i probably don't understand but from my where i sit it's very frustrating um…

Escúchalo en el minuto 47:56

No es nosotros contra la plataforma: desconfia del contenido de trucos y secretos

Estrategia y decisiones de negocio

Su enfoque declarado: ha visto esta publicidad cambiar vidas y generar beneficios, y entiende como funciona y como piensa la empresa que la vende, asi que su trabajo es ayudar a los anunciantes a que funcione a su favor en lugar de plantearlo como una guerra. Lo que la frustra del sector es justamente el contenido de anzuelo, los titulares con el truco para saltarse el sistema y el secreto que la plataforma no…

our different approaches and where we come to this is like yeah i'm someone who believes that like google ads can and i've seen it drive amazing results change lives great profits all this stuff and so i see my role as just helping my clients understand how to make google work for them and the thing that frustrates me so much in the industry with like the clickbait and the twitter headlines is like here's a way to hack the system here's a secret google doesn't watch like really really um so my whole approach is based on like i understand how google ads works as we all do i understand how…

Escúchalo en el minuto 53:22

Los tipos de concordancia ya no hacen lo que dice su nombre

Canales de adquisición

Ensenar esto se volvio casi imposible: la concordancia exacta no es exacta, la de frase no significa frase, y la amplia significa casi cualquier cosa bajo el sol. Su forma de resolverlo en clase es avisar por delante de que es muy confuso, que si el alumno se confunde no pasa nada porque quien lo ensena tambien sigue confundida, y que van a estar confundidos juntos. Antes era mas facil precisamente porque los…

but with the search query report i think before because we had so much more insight and we and match types behaved the way their name suggests jill i know you know this because you teach people but trying to teach people that exact match is not exact and phrase match does not mean phrase and broad match means most things under the sun um it's impossible it's literally i actually teach it by saying this is very confusing so if you're confused don't worry because i'm also still confused and i'm teaching it to you so it's totally fine we can all be confused together but part of the reason i…

Escúchalo en el minuto 47:03

Deberia una plataforma avisar de que su producto no te conviene

Estrategia y decisiones de negocio

Un asistente plantea que si la plataforma sabe que cierto tamano de negocio o cierto sector no funciona bien con publicidad de pago, lo etico seria decirlo, y eso aumentaria la confianza general. La respuesta desde el lado de la plataforma: que otro negocio comprueba primero si estas cualificado para usar su producto antes de venderte. La replica es inmediata y usa el ejemplo de la propia interlocutora, que acababa…

so i am with you there um we have kirk saying to us in the chat nice to see you kirk that if google is aware of a certain business size or vertical not working well for ppc it would be ethical to just say that or increase trust overall with brands in my opinion i don't know if it's google's place to say that you know you mentioned earlier amalia that like google is a business and like is there to make money and sometimes we forget about that um but like what other business do we expect that we go to them and try to use it and they're like actually let me just check first if i think you're…

Escúchalo en el minuto 22:18

Se puede discrepar sin ser desagradable, y casi nada aqui es binario

Estrategia y decisiones de negocio

El marco declarado del debate: el proposito no es determinar quien tiene razon, porque no es blanco o negro sino muchos tonos de gris en un oficio que cambia constantemente. Su diagnostico es que por el anzuelo del clic, o por el formato de los mensajes cortos, las opiniones se presentan como la unica forma de hacerlo; existen cosas que si estan mal, pero en su mayoria el sector deberia dejar de pelear por detalles…

in our complicated industry so before we get straight into the debate what we really want to share with you is that the purpose of this debate today is not to say that one of us is right and one of us is wrong it's not black or white it's many shades of gray we work in a complicated industry an industry where things are always changing we can only anticipate what might be in store for us at google marketing live soon so today we really want to show how there are lots of different ways to approach a problem and also how it's possible to disagree without being disagreeable um and i was…

Escúchalo en el minuto 1:39

El algoritmo no quiere tu ayuda: quiere datos y margen

Medición y experimentos

Lo que mas le sorprendio del lanzamiento de las campanas automaticas fue que la senal de audiencia se explicara como una forma de ayudar a la maquina a aprender, porque contradice todo lo que entendia de la automatizacion: el algoritmo quiere mirar cantidades enormes de datos y aprender de ellos, no de lo que observamos los humanos con nuestros sesgos. Entiende el impulso de querer ayudarla, pero no lo comparte: su…

it's so because to me the thing that surprised me most when performance max was announced was the audience signal and the audience signal being explained as a way for you to help the machines learn because that runs like counter to everything i've learned thought about automation like um the algorithm doesn't want your help to learn the algorithm wants to look at tons of data and learn from data not from what we humans are observing and biased and whatever um so like i get the instinct to want to help the machines learn i'm surprised that an audience signal works that way but i actually don't…

Escúchalo en el minuto 52:26

De rechazar toda automatizacion a aceptar que la puja automatica es bastante buena

Medición y experimentos

Una de las dos cuenta su propio cambio de postura: hace seis anos estaba en el nunca jamas aprendizaje automatico, y hoy sostiene que la puja automatica es bastante buena y que el aprendizaje automatico puede ayudar. Lo que la movio fue la conversacion con tres colegas del sector a los que nombra, y el entender que asi es como aprenden las maquinas y que disponen de senales a las que los anunciantes no tienen…

to let the system learn and i also understand though and this is something that a bunch of people in in industry aaron levy patrick gilbert have uh and kirk as well actually have helped me just shift my perspective on because i six years ago was like no machine learning ever and then now i'm like automated bidding is pretty great and like machine learning can be helpful wait wait say that again say that again automated bidding is pretty great but something she said everyone it depends um but i have shifted my perspective like i understand that's literally how machines learn and that they do…

Escúchalo en el minuto 42:14

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